Terminology and the Attitude of Some Ordinariate Priests
June 8, 2012 15 Comments
Fr Michael Gollop SSC is profoundly irritated:
Does anyone else find it somewhat disappointing that when some (thankfully, by no means all) of our friends and former ‘colleagues’ find a new ecclesial home they begin to refer to ‘Anglican ministers’ or ‘vicars’ instead of the terms they would once unfailingly have used to describe those in Anglican orders? It becomes even less explicable when they are part of a body which makes an entirely convincing claim to be able to offer a secure and lasting place for orthodox Anglican patrimony and the only guaranteed safe haven for the Anglo-Catholic tradition.
I understand the precedents; didn’t Bl John Henry Newman use precisely this kind of terminology? Yet this is not the nineteenth century; the provisions of Anglicanorum Coetibus go out of their way to recognise the displaced catholicity of many in the Anglican Communion, not to mention the undoubted progress that had been made towards reconciliation before ‘the dedicated followers of fashion’ threw additional roadblocks in its path.
Before anyone comments, I’m fully aware of the statements of the Catholic Church on the subject of Anglican orders from Apostolicae Curae onwards. I’m also aware that because of Anglican innovations (the historical irony is painful – so much for ‘the constant Tradition of the primitive church’ in Bramhall’s phrase) the subject will never now be re-examined. Yet those who were once in Anglican orders know better than any that, even if they now have reasonable doubts about the form or intention of their erstwhile ordinations, they were originally ordained as ‘deacons’ or ‘priests’, not ‘ministers’ or ‘vicars.’
I say this extremely reluctantly and without any wish to be confrontational or to seem in any way whatsoever ‘anti-Ordinariate’, just to point out that the minority who express themselves in this way are in danger of provoking unnecessary antagonism among those who wish them and Pope Benedict’s initiative only well. If someone so sympathetic to the Ordinariates can have this reaction, what must be its effect on those who are more undecided?
Of course, it may be said (by some it is often said) that the truth is meant to hurt, and that an uncompromising expression of the ecclesial realities may prove a spur to immediate action, yet the first impression given to those on the receiving end is one of a calculated rudeness and discourtesy, and perhaps to sense in those concerned to dole out this ‘speaking of the truth in love’ more of an overriding desire to find acceptance in their new home rather than any more pressing evangelistic motive towards those they have left, hopefully temporarily, behind.
I would guess that most Anglo-Catholics (for want of a better term) who remain pro tem in Anglican structures are concerned less about the possible defects of Anglican ordinations than about the contemporary and – because of its loss of even a claim to apostolicity in holy order – irrevocable apostasy of a Communion which seemed to be on a path of theological convergence both with Rome and Orthodoxy.
But the last word on this should probably go to St Francis de Sales, not an unsuccessful evangelist in the heartland of Calvinism itself, who remarked that you can catch more flies with a spoonful of honey than with ten barrels of vinegar.
While the truth (theology) indeed needs to be brought to bear, as I have noticed on my own blog (and in real life), far more kindness, forbearance and Christian love and charity is needed – on both sides. In fact, I would go as far as to say (the point is made above) that such would go a long way in winning over others to one’s own held position.

Btw, for those that don’t know, the SSC is an Anglican society (Anglo-Catholic)… The Society of the Holy Cross (SSC) is an international Anglo-Catholic society of priests with members in the Anglican Communion and the Continuing Anglican Movement. The society’s name is abbreviated as SSC from the initials of the society’s Latin name, Societas Sanctae Crucis.
I think to be balances you should also report the comments on his blog
And with most of which (and I’m not referring to my own comments!) I’m in full agreement. But words matter, and we should all be careful how we use them…
I definitely noticed this by some former Anglican now Catholic Priests and it annoys me no end. I think some feel they have to denigrate their former status to show they are now “true believers” and “authentic Priests”. I find this sad. How many years did they believe and refer to themselves as priests? Back in the late 60′s ,early 70′s I met a couple of Episcopal clergy who referred to themselves as ministers and would not be called ‘Father’ but ‘reverend’(very Methodist) or even just ‘mister’. They were all ‘evangelical’ and ‘low church’ types. Figured they just were confused and got lost in the ordination line. Like I said they were probably Methodists at heart.
I have read an English translation of “Apostolicae Curae” and I get totally different understanding of some parts than what others assume is being said. May be it’s just me and my wanting to make lemonade out of lemons.
I have been down this road somewhat, some people, even Anglicans have asked me why I still use the term “Father”? And of course, outside the historical Anglo-Catholic use, there is the biblical (1 Cor. 4:15) of St. Paul himself, which is always pastoral. And I have been Anglo-Catholic in my own Anglican history (but more so Evangelical and Reformed Anglican now…note I am semi-retired at 62, 3 in a few months). And yes, I am one of those old theolog’s! But, thankfully I do see myself – as at least somewhat – as really “Catholic”, noting and seeing Mary as the Theotokos! (Council of Ephesus) And I would stand close to the EO on the Trinity of God, the Father is the regal and monarchy of the Triune God!
And Amen to Fr. Michael, “words” really do matter! And btw, happy 350 years to the BCP!
Fortunately, the number of offenders is rather low, and hopefully they will get over themselves sooner rather than later. I know that it annoys (and embarrasses) some Roman Catholics too.
The problem is all hypothetical to most of us. Just who are these men? Perhaps Fr Gollop should have a quiet word with the Ordinary rather than stir things up
Hypothetical? Well for people who think everything is fine in the “land” of Ordinariate, but this hardly true in reality! Former Anglicans in the Ordinariate process who seek to “diminish” their own former place, should leave the Ordinariate, and go with the RCIA, simple as that!
The invalidity of Anglican Orders is not only attested by the magisterium of the Catholic Church, but by manyAnglicans themselves throughhout the world..who abominate the idea of the real presence, the eucharistic sacrifice and the Apostpolic succesion. They are the ones true to the English Reformers. Its so sad that there are many sincere Anglicans who do not know the true face of ANGLICANISM.
Far from being vinegar, the realisation of the invalidity of Anglican orders has brought many noble souls into the Church…like Father Ronald Knox.
Any mention of Ronald Knox and the Knox bothers, one simply must include the Anglican priest and Anglo-Catholic Wilfred Knox (1886-1950). He was the early member of the Oratory of the Good Shepherd, and himself simply a godly man! And also a good writer.
http://anglicanhistory.org/england/wlknox/catholic1923/
Btw, Robert ian williams: You should clarify your statement, for Anglicanism has always been historically three aspects, with the Evangelical (the Reformers), the High Church (Tractarian), and the Broad Church (liberals and social reformers).
Tractarianism did dnot emerge until after 1833. The earlier High Church tradition was firmly protestant. Men such as Laud, accepted the validity of contionental non episcopal clergy. Living evidence is in the fact there still is a French presbyterian church in the crypt of Canterbury Cathedral. When the British took over the Cape, the Anglicans used the Dutch reformed Church in Cape Town for 33 years.
Sorry, but this is sort of historically begging the question & issue, indeed the whole Tractarian movement has moved into the centre of Anglicanism, and even the Broad Church now. I can myself even as an Evangelical Anglican soteriologically, admit to some points in the older High Church with the Tractarian since Newman now, etc. And as has been historical noted the EO or Orthodox have themselves acknowledged the Anglican Orders, at least in the past. The point is, it has really been the issue of women’s ordination, and the change in sexual ethics that has finally pressed the Anglo-Catholics toward Rome, at least fully. Those of us who are Evangelical Anglicans would agree with the Anglo-Catholics, who have gone to the Ordinariate, and Rome, on this issue of womens ordination, and sexual ethics. But of course not on the issue of the whole of the Church in the Anglo-Catholic and Catholic sense.
I quote this piece to show that Newman was also a man in flux and change…
“While you stick to the old Church of England ways you are respectable—it is going by a sort of tradition ; when you profess to return to lost Church of England ways you are rational ;—but when you invent a new ceremonial which never was, when you copy the Roman or other foreign rituals, you are neither respectable nor rational. It is sectarian.”—J. H. Newman to Henry Wilberforce. Life of J. H. Cardinal Newman, by W. Ward. 1912. I. 235.
Btw, we can argue Anglican Church history one way and then another, but we simply must agree that the general Anglican Communion, at least the Cof E, and the American Episcopal Church are going quickly apostate! So I don’t blame my Anglo-Catholic brethren for going with Rome, but just some of the statements toward Anglican history and the past episcopate generally.